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Post by donna on Mar 13, 2022 19:24:10 GMT -5
September would be reasonable, for sure. For the rest, the war appears more and more to me as scorched Earth. No one blames the populations, this is a sick game at another level. I think Putin got double-crossed and he's raging. He will ruin the decades of friendlier trade because as per WW2, he feels Russia has been screwed. I'll never understand why innocents must be dragged into this when the pro- and antagonists know each other but don't settle this amongst themselves and cloak this instead in the most insulting way to throw people off the scent. well, she could just be using his new toy from last summer. Not sure about the Israel thing, given that selensky is the one who brought them in to help with negotiations. BUt it is interesting how many of these oligarchs also have an Israely passport. Not that they seem to care much about fellow Jews. A group of Jewish orphans from Odessa has recently arrived here. Given how Germans ravaged the city during WW2 it is significant to see them turn to Germany for help rather than Israel, who btw is not very outspoken against the war due to Putins role in the middle east. Also worrying that Iran has used the opportunity to strike while the world is looking elsewhere. We should not forget, that there are other conflicts still smoldering and that we need to keep an eye on them too. But also that this is Putins war, not the war of Russian people. Even those supporting him are mostly victims of decades of propaganda. The moere respect obviously to those protesters in spite of the risks they are taking. As to protecting her, I don't think that she was in any danger in Switzerland. I think it was simply about time to see how things go. Obviously she needed 30 days for the physical detox. But it has been 3 months now since she is clean and that is a long time. I suspect she will have some day patient care to get her started for another few weeks and build a routine in MC and then they will have her as an out patient taking more and more control. Depending how things go from there she will be back, or not. She needs to master the homefront first, so I won't be expecting her to attend anything official in the next few months. My guess is that the picnic in September is a reasonable and sufficiently intimate occasion for a comeback, but it is a long way until then... The Ukranians are not so innocent. They have been persecuting and killing the Russian minority now since 2014. Those who are bombing in the east two states (those who just declared independence) are Ukranians. It is a war between brothers and the West should stay out of it. Here is an interview with a French woman who made a documentary about Ukraine and the conflict in 2015 and has been living there since. Her testimony is contrary to what western media is trying to force down our throats. www.linkedin.com/posts/lucina-design_today-march-1-2022-anne-laure-bonnet-ugcPost-6904427587876306944-kX9h/ If you go to the primary source, you'll see how the French news anchor people start to argue.
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Post by agentf on Mar 13, 2022 21:05:47 GMT -5
donna Interesting. She's essentially a sports writer who speaks 6+ languages, including Russian where she spent time. We can also talk of the Tatars of Crimea, but then we're in full-on false equivalences territory. I'm sticking for now to a sadistic tweaking of the MIC markets, on one hand. I would have hoped to have been born in a far more elegant era, let's leave it at that for me personally.
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Post by paca on Mar 14, 2022 3:47:20 GMT -5
I still like to point out that the Russians came as part of the ussr and decided to stay. So in my view they came as guests. If a guest tries to takeover my house, I am going to defend myself. The Russians could have always gone to Russia. They wanted to stay in Ukraine and benefit from the liberties, so they should adhere to their rules. Migrants have the same problem everywhere. It takes time and often generations until you are considered a local. Even if you move regions in your own country. There was no doubt discrimination against Russian, but you don't fight it by trying to steal the country. You fight it by getting involved. You won't convince a number of people, but you get influence and power to change things. Without weapons.
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Post by agentf on Mar 14, 2022 11:41:48 GMT -5
I think it's much better to be on good terms with your neighbour, or a guest with their host, for all the possibilities to expand or do things together rather than try to dominate someone increasingly resentful at you which will be exhausting to keep suppressed and will keep from the prospect of these new possibilities. It's literally a reductionist exercise. Vive la différence. Live and let live. I still like to point out that the Russians came as part of the ussr and decided to stay. So in my view they came as guests. If a guest tries to takeover my house, I am going to defend myself. The Russians could have always gone to Russia. They wanted to stay in Ukraine and benefit from the liberties, so they should adhere to their rules. Migrants have the same problem everywhere. It takes time and often generations until you are considered a local. Even if you move regions in your own country. There was no doubt discrimination against Russian, but you don't fight it by trying to steal the country. You fight it by getting involved. You won't convince a number of people, but you get influence and power to change things. Without weapons.
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Post by donna on Mar 14, 2022 16:29:50 GMT -5
I still like to point out that the Russians came as part of the ussr and decided to stay. So in my view they came as guests. If a guest tries to takeover my house, I am going to defend myself. The Russians could have always gone to Russia. They wanted to stay in Ukraine and benefit from the liberties, so they should adhere to their rules. Migrants have the same problem everywhere. It takes time and often generations until you are considered a local. Even if you move regions in your own country. There was no doubt discrimination against Russian, but you don't fight it by trying to steal the country. You fight it by getting involved. You won't convince a number of people, but you get influence and power to change things. Without weapons. I have also been wondering if during the USSR era, the Russians put down Ukrainians. Were Ukrainians for instance allowed to speak their language or were they forced to speak Russian? Did schools only teach in Russian? Was their culture suppressed in any way? If so, it can explain the rage against the Russian minority (migrants). The same as in Sri Lanka with the Tamil population. The English didn't like the lazy buddhist Sri Lankans, so they imported thousands of people from Tamil in India, who were avid workers and held them in greater esteem than the Sri Lankans and gave them important jobs over the Sri Lankans. Of course this made the Sri Lankans resent the Tamils, so when the British left, the Tamils were a minority, suddenly unprotected from the raging Sri Lankans. And we all know how it escalated into war. Same with Rwanda. The Belgians reinforced the minority Tutsis as officials, above the Hutus. The Tutsis abused the Hutus during tax collections, building of bridges and roads. So when the Belgians left, there was this massive rage against these abusers, which broke out in war between them and the Hutus massacred the Tutsis as best they could. That makes one wonder about in the future, when China has retreated from Tibet, what will happen to all the Chinese who have moved to the area. If the Tibetans start killing them massively to the point of genocide and China invades Tibet again to help their fellow countrymen, would we then condemn China and put all kinds of sanctions on them. Just wondering.
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Post by agentf on Mar 14, 2022 17:32:15 GMT -5
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drusi
New Member
Posts: 5
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Post by drusi on Mar 15, 2022 16:31:29 GMT -5
Is this still the CW's news thread ?? 🤔
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Post by agentf on Mar 15, 2022 17:07:15 GMT -5
😄 It's been highjacked in favour of Ukraine. Good of you to contribute... 😉 Would you like to say something about CC or just moderate. Is this still the CW's news thread ?? 🤔
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Post by agentf on Mar 15, 2022 22:02:36 GMT -5
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Post by margarita on Mar 15, 2022 23:58:13 GMT -5
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Post by margarita on Mar 16, 2022 0:51:36 GMT -5
About Ukraine. This whole topic is much more complex as shown in our media. The first capital of Russia was Kiev. Many ethnic russians live in Ukraine, most of them in the eastern part. It's a bit like the Sorbs in Germany, a slavic minority which lives close to the polish border. minorityrights.org/minorities/sorbs/In the area where they live their language is a second official language. It is tought at school. The names of the town are written always in German and in their own language. Their rights to live their culture and beware their identity is rooted in the constitution. And now lets look at Ukraine: there are far more Russians living there as Sorbs in German. But like for the Sorbes it is their home for centuries! After the Maidan revolution russian was no official language anymore. The new people in charge fought everything "russian". At school only ukraine language was tought. But thats the top of the iceberg. I was in the city of Dnepropetrovsk which became Dnipro some years ago. I asked how is live there and a man told me that he is russian, his wife ukrainian and at school the kids had to learn poems full of hate against the Russians. They handed out flyers picturing Russians like they were pictured in Nazi-Germany with text in ukraine:" Papa - kill the Russian!" I heared it with my own ears! Thats no propaganda. It is a fact. Like it is a fact that nazi extremists became part of the official ukraine army! Unbelievable in ANY western country - especially in Germany. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_BattalionThe azov troops and others killed thousands!!! of civilians since 2014 in the eastern parts of Ukraine. I somehow missed the sanctions against the Ukraine government. And the pictures of the killed children and women and priests in our news! We did not see the pictures thats why nothing happened. But I can post some links. The situation of the Donbass conflict should and could have been solved by the Minsk Agreement. But it was the Ukrainian government that did not do their homeworks too! And if you listen carefully to the speeches of Lavrov ... the implementation of the Minsk Agreenent was one of the main goals Russia wanted to see fulfilled. But the western countries did not force the Ukrainian government to fulfill their part of the agreement. Selensky & Co. felt the backing of the West. And here is our part of the guilt. We are talking about a government that has NO problem with right wing extremists troops, nazi-soldiers as official part of their army. Which turned a blind eye to the killing of civilians for 8 years! Sorry - that way they are VERY far away from the European family. Plus: Ukraine is highly corrupt. They would have to go a loooong way and do much more homeworks then the Minsk agreement to become part of the European Union! The NATO does not really want them. So it would have been much more clever and realistic to be honest to Ukraine from the western side to say: Become a neutral zone. AND IF Russia will attack anyway - we will imply sanctions against Russia! Like the sanctions the West has announced now. Protection of minorities (not only the russian!) was one of the points Lawrow demanded before they send troops. I think this catastrophy could have been prevented if we (the West) would have been more honest and realistic towards Ukraine! I help refugees, I send humanitarian help and money to Ukraine. I have friends there! (and always told them 'don't rely on the west - they (ab)use you against the Russians but won't step in in case they attack!' Thats what we see now.) I feel really sorry for the ukraine civilians. But I already did send help to orphans from Donbass who became evacuated to Russia as well - and will continue too. This medal (yes donna!) has two sides. And one of these sides is clearly underrepresented in western media. PEACE for Ukraine! PEACE for Russia! PEACE for Europe!!
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Post by agentf on Mar 16, 2022 6:24:16 GMT -5
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Post by donna on Mar 16, 2022 18:59:07 GMT -5
I think he didn't say total catastrophy if she leaves. What does the German word Obergau mean? There is no translation for it online. I would guess that Obergau was more an inconvenience. Otherwise, he thinks that staying in a toxic marriage is better for a family and children, that getting out and becoming a stronger happy parent.
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Post by agentf on Mar 16, 2022 19:08:59 GMT -5
That Gossip blog says the cat fight is beginning, with Nicole who went ahead and wished Albert a happy birthday on social media while CC is said to not have even come to the balcony for a surprise impromptu concert, leaving some to speculate (!) that she was not at the palace. 🤷🏻♀️ What's more, Caroline apparently would have made an executive decision about the kids' education and Albert sided with his sister. Drama!!
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Post by margarita on Mar 16, 2022 23:31:45 GMT -5
I think he didn't say total catastrophy if she leaves. What does the German word Obergau mean? There is no translation for it online. I would guess that Obergau was more an inconvenience. Otherwise, he thinks that staying in a toxic marriage is better for a family and children, that getting out and becoming a stronger happy parent. Hi Donna, GAU means Grösster Anzunehmender Unfall - Worst situation that might occure. Ober- means something like 'total' in this context. So 'total catastrophy' is what he said. I agree about toxic parents. The tensions could do additional harm to the kids. I think Begasse just tried to say what many of us wrote before - Albert waited so many years to find 'the right one'. And then this... Lets wait and see - maybe the therapy really changed her to the better?
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Post by donna on Mar 17, 2022 6:00:17 GMT -5
About Ukraine. This whole topic is much more complex as shown in our media. The first capital of Russia was Kiev. Many ethnic russians live in Ukraine, most of them in the eastern part. It's a bit like the Sorbs in Germany, a slavic minority which lives close to the polish border. minorityrights.org/minorities/sorbs/In the area where they live their language is a second official language. It is tought at school. The names of the town are written always in German and in their own language. Their rights to live their culture and beware their identity is rooted in the constitution. And now lets look at Ukraine: there are far more Russians living there as Sorbs in German. But like for the Sorbes it is their home for centuries! After the Maidan revolution russian was no official language anymore. The new people in charge fought everything "russian". At school only ukraine language was tought. But thats the top of the iceberg. I was in the city of Dnepropetrovsk which became Dnipro some years ago. I asked how is live there and a man told me that he is russian, his wife ukrainian and at school the kids had to learn poems full of hate against the Russians. They handed out flyers picturing Russians like they were pictured in Nazi-Germany with text in ukraine:" Papa - kill the Russian!" I heared it with my own ears! Thats no propaganda. It is a fact. Like it is a fact that nazi extremists became part of the official ukraine army! Unbelievable in ANY western country - especially in Germany. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_BattalionThe azov troops and others killed thousands!!! of civilians since 2014 in the eastern parts of Ukraine. I somehow missed the sanctions against the Ukraine government. And the pictures of the killed children and women and priests in our news! We did not see the pictures thats why nothing happened. But I can post some links. The situation of the Donbass conflict should and could have been solved by the Minsk Agreement. But it was the Ukrainian government that did not do their homeworks too! And if you listen carefully to the speeches of Lavrov ... the implementation of the Minsk Agreenent was one of the main goals Russia wanted to see fulfilled. But the western countries did not force the Ukrainian government to fulfill their part of the agreement. Selensky & Co. felt the backing of the West. And here is our part of the guilt. We are talking about a government that has NO problem with right wing extremists troops, nazi-soldiers as official part of their army. Which turned a blind eye to the killing of civilians for 8 years! Sorry - that way they are VERY far away from the European family. Plus: Ukraine is highly corrupt. They would have to go a loooong way and do much more homeworks then the Minsk agreement to become part of the European Union! The NATO does not really want them. So it would have been much more clever and realistic to be honest to Ukraine from the western side to say: Become a neutral zone. AND IF Russia will attack anyway - we will imply sanctions against Russia! Like the sanctions the West has announced now. Protection of minorities (not only the russian!) was one of the points Lawrow demanded before they send troops. I think this catastrophy could have been prevented if we (the West) would have been more honest and realistic towards Ukraine! I help refugees, I send humanitarian help and money to Ukraine. I have friends there! (and always told them 'don't rely on the west - they (ab)use you against the Russians but won't step in in case they attack!' Thats what we see now.) I feel really sorry for the ukraine civilians. But I already did send help to orphans from Donbass who became evacuated to Russia as well - and will continue too. This medal (yes donna!) has two sides. And one of these sides is clearly underrepresented in western media. PEACE for Ukraine! PEACE for Russia! PEACE for Europe!! Thank you Margarita. I know that all of this is true. And I think the pictures the media is depicting are Russian civilians being slaughtered by the far right extremist. Russian soldiers have been ordered not to kill civilians, because Russia wants Ukraine to be on it's side, not enemies. So I don't believe any story about Russian solders killing civilians in line to buy bread.
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Post by agentf on Mar 17, 2022 9:29:33 GMT -5
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Post by donna on Mar 17, 2022 18:20:29 GMT -5
According to UN only 500 have been killed, including 13 children since the war broke out. I don't think that is a lot for three weeks. If civilians were their target, easily millions could be dead. Also, providing weapons to civilians makes them a target.
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Post by agentf on Mar 17, 2022 21:11:03 GMT -5
Then I suppose Ukrainians all decided at the last minute to take a holiday in surrounding countries without much luggage... 🤦🏻♀️ According to UN only 500 have been killed, including 13 children since the war broke out. I don't think that is a lot for three weeks. If civilians were their target, easily millions could be dead. Also, providing weapons to civilians makes them a target.
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Post by margarita on Mar 18, 2022 0:48:59 GMT -5
The Russians say - and that I believe - that they do everything to avoid civil victims. And this sounds logic because they have to continue to live with the Ukrainians next door. Its not like the U.S. army bombing Baghdad back then.
But about 25.000 machine guns were handed out to everyone who wanted to take one only in Kiev. Without registration! My first thought was - how to get them back when the war is over?! How to control in which hands they get later on...? Thats highly dangerous for the inner safety of the ukrainian society itself!
Dangerous criminals were released from jail, provided with weapons to fight the Russians.
Do they do harm only to the Russians?
Thousands of untrained people who never held a gun try to shoot Russians. Do they hit only Russians in a crowded town?
And then you have the ukrainian tanks placed between living houses - its horrible that the people living there are killed - but they were not the tatget.
A man with (any kind of) weapon in the hand is a legitimate target.
Sorry - in my eyes it was a very bad idea of Mr. Selensky to ask people to build molotov cocktails and go out to fight. They have almost no chance!
And without the yellow armlet not even the status of combatant.
Its total chaos in many cities, no place where one can be safe so I would flee too. But that does not mean that the Russians kill civilans by purpose.
Its a tragedy that could have been prevented and that makes me really furious.
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