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Post by paca on Apr 18, 2011 13:31:37 GMT -5
The woman victim said that she was in counseling. Maybe her therapist recommended that she file this complaint to aid her in her recovery. Sometimes when the woman tries to just forget it and move on, she never really can because she continues to feel like a victim, and seeing Albert's picture all the time and him representing himself as this great guy could be agitating her. At this point, since I don't know anything really about this woman, but have a really low opinion of how Albert treats women, I believe that he did this and has done it to other women. And Charlene standing by him while he does these things, tells me a lot about her. On the art show, maybe she has an agent who recommended that she show her art at this forum to get some publicity. She has to live on and support herself and may not be able to be choosy as to where she showcases her work. I doubt anything will come of this and the woman seems to indicate that she expects nothing. I believe that Albert has immunity, so Nice authorities probably will not waste time on it, unless they have more women come forward. One would think that if it is a lie, Albert would sue to regain his "good" reputation. JMO ;D I do think that Albert treats most women badly, including CW (as we have seen with his lack of manners towards her), but proving rape is very difficult and after such a long time and with only Eringer and his agenda speaking for her, I can't come to a conclusion on this. I do take these allegations with a grain of salt though, as it has become quite a trend of women riding this card to get short lived and dubious fame. This woman is at 35 a possibly struggling artist, who in all likely hood can not live of her art. I know a number of women in Monaco who call themselves artists and make a lot of fuss about themselves and their so called art. Personally I wouldn't call it art, but wall decoration. these people sell their stuff to people with enough money in their circles, but not enough to buy really good art or in possession of any knowledge about it. the works are exhibited in restaurants where these people eat and the restaurant owners agree to display them, as they will send their friends as customers. There are no agents involved as agents cost money. they use facebook and other internet outlets to sell their things (or better hoping to sell their things), but mostly they are selling to their ff with enough money. those who buy these pics don't care about art or the person they are buying these of too much. They just don't want a print of a famous work on their wall and if anyone makes a polite comment on a picture on their wall, they want to be able to say that the artist is a friend of theirs so that THEY look good/cultured. And for those "artists" it's a way of getting some identity other then being the cast off housewives of some rich guy who got themselves a younger version to replace her. They usually got a good divorce settlement, which allows them to continue the lifestyle they had, so work is not necessary, but whereas the men have new partners, these women around or over forty have to face with the fact that in this area no man with enough money for their upkeep and in their age range would take them. looking at the alleged victims site, I have to say, though I am not an expert, I don't think she is particularly good or original. It's probably easier to put the blame on sth or someone else then admitting that she just is not as good as she thought. And even then, there are so many out there and some really talented, that it takes a lot, especially as a woman to get attention. since she is not what people consider a looker here, but an average looking middle aged woman, she doesn't draw attention that way either. So a little press with her name mentioned might do her a world of good. I'm not trying to pick on her, just putting things in perspective.
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Post by refia on Apr 18, 2011 13:40:16 GMT -5
What on earth did Grace and Rainier raise? And I hope Prince Guillaume stays far away from him. Do you know if he attends the Monaco weddng? I don´t think that GD Henri and GDss Maria Teresa would attend. And yes, Gui go away from him!
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Post by hibou on Apr 18, 2011 13:59:57 GMT -5
I think the most bothersome thing about this situation is that we all have doubts as to who to believe. The fact that we have these doubts did he or didn't he really speaks to the character problem with Albert. In reality we should have no doubt that this situation could even remotely be possible, yet some of us do. In the end the fact that there is doubt speaks volumes.
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Post by MyAdia on Apr 18, 2011 14:19:10 GMT -5
I think the most bothersome thing about this situation is that we all have doubts as to who to believe. The fact that we have these doubts did he or didn't he really speaks to the character problem with Albert. In reality we should have no doubt that this situation could even remotely be possible, yet some of us do. In the end the fact that there is doubt speaks volumes. Exactly Hibou. I recall on the former Monaco Freeforums some of us were at each others throats for even mentioning that Albert would rape a woman. I for one am one of those who wouldn't have ANY doubts before, but now I do. Albert has shown me that he is not as smart or honorable as I thought he was.
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Post by margarita on Apr 18, 2011 15:15:25 GMT -5
Just a thought: The entire world believes that Albert loved his mother above everything and had a serious problem with his father. Obviously even Albert himself believes that... Usually men who rape women or treat women badly had ... a problem with their mother. As much as I know about Grace I really adore her ... however: has anyone ever thought that Albert might have a problem with his mother actually ? The Saint-Grace myth is so strong even today and maybe Albert himself believes it and thinks he has to find a woman like his mother. But what if there is a shady side of Grace - and Albert and his father suffered of that? What if Albert choosed this aspect in CW? To become a victim and get out of this role? I know it is hard to compare these two but anyway: maybe he treats woman badly because his mother treated men badly? A bold thought after three glases of good white wine... There are just too many indicators... At the current state his shrink (if he has one but I could swear from the words he choosed in the interview in Austria speaking about the support he will have to give to his future wife because that's what a marriage depends on ... it were not his words) thinks that he/ she might cure Albert telling him he has to treat woman good - and CW is the ultimate proof whether he is cured already or not. No matter how icy and bad and immature she is - you have to support her and stick to her to proof he is a real grown up man. That's why he sticks to her! While ... someone who really cared and understood should have said: Albert run!!! Dump CW and make your peace with your father AND your mother. Draw your own conclusions. Only then you can find true love...
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Post by refia on Apr 18, 2011 15:19:06 GMT -5
No, I don´t think that Grace treated men badly. Okay that she left her boyfriend because her parents didn´t want him is an other story. I heard that Grace had alcohol problems. Don´t know if this is true. On the other side, she took the mother role serious. But who knows?
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Post by creativemind on Apr 18, 2011 15:34:26 GMT -5
Yeah! Welcome back Paca! A newbie had PMed me and asked me who is htis PACA that people mentioned. I tried to explain - but now she can find out for herself! PACA IS A LEGEND AROUND HERE!!! [in a fab way!!]
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Post by creativemind on Apr 18, 2011 15:39:36 GMT -5
this is a tough one since it happened what -- 6 years ago. while i cringe at doubting a woman when she says she's been sexually assault, i find it coming out now rather suspect -- although i do tend to believe a great deal of what eringer posts [with his eringer-esque coloring of the situations involving monaco's cast of shady characters. i think i'm going to have to wait and see what else comes out -- if at all.
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Post by pippi on Apr 18, 2011 15:49:34 GMT -5
PACA, welcome nice to see your creativity here once more
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Post by paca on Apr 18, 2011 16:01:35 GMT -5
Yeah! Welcome back Paca! A newbie had PMed me and asked me who is htis PACA that people mentioned. I tried to explain - but now she can find out for herself! PACA IS A LEGEND AROUND HERE!!! [in a fab way!!] rofl thx but a rather undeserved fame
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Post by paca on Apr 18, 2011 16:26:58 GMT -5
No, I don´t think that Grace treated men badly. Okay that she left her boyfriend because her parents didn´t want him is an other story. I heard that Grace had alcohol problems. Don´t know if this is true. On the other side, she took the mother role serious. But who knows? well she was setting herself up with Rainier, without letting her bf know that she had set her mind on becoming a princess, not quite nice behaviour and not very catholic either. while she was young she drew people to Monaco, especially her Hollywood friends who were stars. apart from getting herself pictured she didn't have much influence in Monaco. For someone who claims that acting was her passion, she didn't do anything in that respect in Monaco. yes she wasn't able to do it herself due to her position, but she did not establish a theater or ensemble here. The theater was set up AFTER her death, as was the foundation to help young artists. she did nothing of the kind when alive. Her acting was about herself and having herself noticed and getting recognition. It wasn't about art or because she was so passionate about acting. As to her myth: I had a professor at university who wrote about the myth that is created around women and especially beautiful women who die young. They don't have to have done anything extraordinary, it is enough to die relatively young: Marilyn, Grace, Diana. the fact that they died so young allows for others to project whatever they wish on these people and imagine what they might have done, which they most likely wouldn't have done: Marilyn would have continued having affairs and marriages along with drugs, Diana was with her self victimizing and not getting over Charles and Camilla on everyones nerves (at least while I lived in ENgland) and Grace would have probably ended like Queen Mum pickling herself in alcohol whilst pursuing her depressing hobby of putting pressed flowers in a particular way on paper. If CW wants that kind of fame, she better start on thinking about how to get a great exit before the surgery deformations start to show too obviously. Apart from that she won't have much chance of being remembered in Monaco if she manages to stick with boldie until his death.
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Post by pippi on Apr 18, 2011 16:34:22 GMT -5
No, I don´t think that Grace treated men badly. Okay that she left her boyfriend because her parents didn´t want him is an other story. I heard that Grace had alcohol problems. Don´t know if this is true. On the other side, she took the mother role serious. But who knows? well she was setting herself up with Rainier, without letting her bf know that she had set her mind on becoming a princess, not quite nice behaviour and not very catholic either. while she was young she drew people to Monaco, especially her Hollywood friends who were stars. apart from getting herself pictured she didn't have much influence in Monaco. For someone who claims that acting was her passion, she didn't do anything in that respect in Monaco. yes she wasn't able to do it herself due to her position, but she did not establish a theater or ensemble here. The theater was set up AFTER her death, as was the foundation to help young artists. she did nothing of the kind when alive. Her acting was about herself and having herself noticed and getting recognition. It wasn't about art or because she was so passionate about acting. As to her myth: I had a professor at university who wrote about the myth that is created around women and especially beautiful women who die young. They don't have to have done anything extraordinary, it is enough to die relatively young: Marilyn, Grace, Diana. the fact that they died so young allows for others to project whatever they wish on these people and imagine what they might have done, which they most likely wouldn't have done: Marilyn would have continued having affairs and marriages along with drugs, Diana was with her self victimizing and not getting over Charles and Camilla on everyones nerves (at least while I lived in ENgland) and Grace would have probably ended like Queen Mum pickling herself in alcohol whilst pursuing her depressing hobby of putting pressed flowers in a particular way on paper. If CW wants that kind of fame, she better start on thinking about how to get a great exit before the surgery deformations start to show too obviously. Apart from that she won't have much chance of being remembered in Monaco if she manages to stick with boldie until his death. Paca, I like this very clever observation from you. Karma to you.
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Post by emmeline on Apr 18, 2011 16:57:25 GMT -5
Paca, you are awesome!
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sophia
Junior Member
Posts: 74
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Post by sophia on Apr 18, 2011 17:52:00 GMT -5
Didn't Grace primarily live in Paris. Maybe Albert thought she abandoned him and didn't stick up for him enough against his father.
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Post by refia on Apr 18, 2011 18:19:17 GMT -5
Grace observed Caroline in Paris IIRC.
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Post by paca on Apr 18, 2011 19:14:53 GMT -5
Grace observed Caroline in Paris IIRC. she wasn't very successful there either...none of their children seems to have received the kind of raising they needed. considering the outcome Rainier and Grace must have been lousy parents and it's not just after Grace's death they started showing problems: Caro was a party girl, Steph got herself kicked out of ST maur and Albert was a lazy playboy, whose last memory with Grace is of him having a quarrel with his mom about getting out of bed on a late Monday morning (at least I think it was a Monday morning th accident happened). ANd it seems that only the girls have managed to move on, though Steph a lot later then Caro, or maybe she has after rainier's death just realized that she is no longer protected and has become more discrete. Her choice of men certainly hasn't improved.
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Post by hibou on Apr 18, 2011 19:37:33 GMT -5
Grace observed Caroline in Paris IIRC. she wasn't very successful there either...none of their children seems to have received the kind of raising they needed. considering the outcome Rainier and Grace must have been lousy parents and it's not just after Grace's death they started showing problems: Caro was a party girl, Steph got herself kicked out of ST maur and Albert was a lazy playboy, whose last memory with Grace is of him having a quarrel with his mom about getting out of bed on a late Monday morning (at least I think it was a Monday morning th accident happened). ANd it seems that only the girls have managed to move on, though Steph a lot later then Caro, or maybe she has after rainier's death just realized that she is no longer protected and has become more discrete. Her choice of men certainly hasn't improved. Something definitely went wrong. I remember reading that Caroline was a good student until she graduated and moved to Paris to attend college. It was there that she started to rebel and to party. Grace seemed to loose control. In the meantime, Stephanie was also rebelling. So Grace had her hands full. Ranier stayed in Monaco so he was not much help, and Albert stayed behind with Rainier. So Grace was of no help. None of the kids really ever held a job or had responsibilities that would settle them down. All were used to being photographed and adored by the paparazzi. Once Grace died, Caroline seemed to settle down and Stephanie continued her wild ways. Albert as we now know was wild too, leaving a trail of photos and babies it would seem. As a parent, I am reluctant to place all the blame on Grace and Rainier, the kids also have to take responsibility for their lives. Stephanie does seem to be a good Mother so may be she learned from her own mistakes? Albert turned out to be a complete failure as far as I can tell. JMO
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blue j
Full Member
Charlene: I hit the Jackpot, the sucker prince Albert.
Posts: 231
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Post by blue j on Apr 18, 2011 20:51:47 GMT -5
I agree with Chriss and CM on this one - NO means NO! "She should have known what to expect" is the same justification that people used for Mike Tyson when a naive 18 year went to his hotel room in the wee hours of the woman and he brutally raped her. Please read the Elsa Caselli's story for yourself on Eringer's blog. Honestly, I still haven't made my mind up about what to believe. However, I can DEFINITELY understand why the woman wouldn't have ran to the police. Please understand rape is one of the least reported crimes in the world, so please do not be surprised that a woman would not report that a billion head of state Sovereign Prince rape her! ]Also Bluej, where did you read that the woman dated Albert after the allegedly attack? The full story you mention is not in Eringer's suit, I just pulled it out and read it and this is all that he mentions about the incident. We need to be careful before we just assume this as a fact. Rape is too serious of a charge for both the supposedly victim and supposedly attacker. But, IF she did date Albert afterward, she has lost all credibility since she is now claiming it was a violent attack. From page 8 of the 165-page complaint file on 5 October 2009. It was in 2010, I don't remember exactly when, I saw second version of Eringer compliant with all exhibits and one of them included handwritten letter by the woman who claimed to be raped by Albert. Probably many remember that Eringer compliant was available online since autumn of 2009 when Eringer filed lawsuit. This first version included evidence that seemed to have all documents Eringer included as proofs in his lawsuit. Then somewhere in 2010, briefly, there was available another version of lawsuit docs of , that I call 2nd one, and that included this unfortunate handwritten letter. I saw this letter by this woman written in English and French. There was something in this letter indicating that woman continued to have contact/ seeing Albert. BTW, myadia, you pointed out in your post that there was a picture of Elsa with PA on Eringer blog. IMO, It wasn't taken on yacht, and not at reception where she met Albert first time. It seems a sport event, so this woman had to see Albert at least once after alleged rape. I'm not unsympathetic for sexual assault victims and I have nothing against Elsa. I just try to put facts together, and she doesn't seem a victim for me. I put together what I remember from her handwritten letter (I may not remember everything correctly) and what I read on Eringer blog last Sunday.
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Post by cm7007 on Apr 18, 2011 22:39:44 GMT -5
[/quote] Guys! Does anyone still think that these "prearranged group rapes" were not filmed!!! That's part of the kick these guys get out of doing this kind of thing. Happens in good old Hollywood a lot. Once in a great while a dumb dora daughter of someone fairly important gets nailed and then a "heavy weight" in the business is called in to do damage control - privately - the film is destroyed! Later he'll call in his "chit". I know cause I was involved with one of those heavy weights. How much footage do you suppose they've got on CW to allow her to be in the position she's in. They need enough to control her - and HIM! Anyone see a remake of Deep Throat on the horizon ;D? Well, PA said he wants to give away all his money before he dies - Seems to me he's well on his way. How does the poor house sound to you CW?
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Post by mrplowfan on Apr 19, 2011 3:17:06 GMT -5
The reason FATAL wants to give away all his money before his dies is to put one last screw into the two innocent kids who had no choice but to be related to him. He'll leave money for his and CHARTARD's test tube babies but nothing for his "weakness of the flesh" real children.
He's a disgusting bastard. If he did rape this girl, I hope she presses charges and goes to the press - more than Eringer. If there's one, there are more.
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